Actors should definitely not appear as tags... (at that rate sooner or later someone will tag the image with the title of the movie).
I guess tags are a bit of a problem because it's a great idea, but it'll also often give unwanted hints towards the solution. Strict rules should be decided defining what is acceptable as a tag.
Well, tags should simply be descriptive and nothing more. Describe what can be seen in the still. Not whatever else one knows about the movie or actors. Hmm, certain connotations are ok as well I guess... tags like "scary"
There's another thing that bothers me a bit about the tags... when I search for a tag, it will only search for the *exact* tag I entered. Say I wish to find this shot: http://whatthemovie.com/shot/20234 So I try entering "woman mud", but I will get no results, because "woman" and "mud" are two seperate keywords. Which also means these keywords are almost completely useless, because it would be impossible to find this particular shot by entering JUST "woman"
I agree completely with connectiv. The tags should only be descriptive. However, I think it is extremely difficult to monitor. Maybe it gets better if there is a certain amount of clapper loader who are allowed to delete tags.
@connectiv: For your second point regarding the search for more than one tag I already filed a feature request some days ago. But I think it will take some time since there are still more urgent things to do for the guys of whatthemovie (who did a great job by the way).
@theoffice911: I also agree with car models. They should not be mentioned in the tags. One still can describe cars by using tags as "silver oldtimer" or "red sports car". However, the car model in the tag of 20238 is wrong :-) It is not a Rolls Royce.
I've talked about this topic in the chat: maybe we manage to give a handful of active people acces to vote-delete and tag-delete, etc even before they reach the apropriate rank.
The new rank system is focused on new members. All of you who have been with the site for a long time would certainly already have a high rank.
@Naut. It might be good in that case (to think about) being able to send a message to someone to tell what was wring with the tag (in order to prevent stubborn re-adding of the same tag)?
Why not limit tags to archive shots ? I mean, we could add tags to all movies (including features shots) but we don't see the tags before the shot goes to the archive (that way it gets tagged properly by people as they guess it in the featured films). Also for the archive, hide the tags by default and add a button (or a user option) to show them if needed.
After all, tags are mainly used for searching purposes, so there's no need to see the tags when we see the shot.
If we don't see tags while pics are in the Feature Films section, those pictures might get "overtagged".
But I agree with you on this : to me, tags are only useful to go back to pics that I didn't solve yet. Maybe tags should be user-associated, then ? I mean : you tag pics any way you like, but only you can see those tags.
You need the job "focus puller" to be able to tag (300 wtm bucks). Once you got that, you'll see a link for adding tags right in the tags section beneath each screenshot.
http://whatthemovie.com/shot/20545 = 20545 Come on, tagging this picture with "looks like MJ" and "bad" must be a joke. A view clicks on imdb and you'll have the right answer...
One thing i thought about is that maybe tags should be personal. I mean as other said tags are used mainly to go back to shots you didnt solved, and that is personal. Personally i dont really care about others tags. So at least i would think we could have public and private tags in archives and maybe only private tags in feature and new submissions. What do you think?
These screenshots are basically just headshots of famous actors, which makes them incredibly easy and boring. I figured that tags would be seen by more people, especially since most people don't venture into the forum. I also used the following rules so that it wouldn't effect the game:
I have only put tags on shots that: 1. Have super famous actors on them, whom most people can easily identify (not actors first movie, not actors from the 40s or 50s that everyone should know, but probably doesn't) 2. Have the actors full face showing, without costume or even large glasses. 3. Have a large number of votes (relative to time since uploaded). 4. Are not an interesting or important scene (eg, this got tagge: http://whatthemovie.com/shot/21558 , but not this: http://whatthemovie.com/shot/20742)
Now, this is all subjective, and I can see some people being insulted by this, but I'm just trying to help. These kinds of shots used to be rejected by the moderators (sometimes, anyway) because they are too easy to imdb, but now they are always getting voted through.
So, am I just being a jerk, or is this constructive? Would it be better to just vote-to-delete them (I don't know why I didn't think of this before)?
While I can personally appreciate what you are trying to do, I think you should just leave them be. At the end of the day, the new democracy rules will decide if they go through or not. I definitely dont think you should vote delete them.
If you think its a bad screenshot, then vote it with a low score, thats what the voting system is for. The tags are meant to be used to index and find images, not berate the poster. The occasional joke in the tags is alright by me though hehe ;)
There are no rules to say what deserves a high score or low score, so technically to vote an image a 1 because it is very obvious is OK. If more people think the same as you (and I may or may not do this myself ;) ) then they will do the same. :)
As I say though, I can see why you might do this, but I can also see why people might find this tag a little upsetting. If you submit 10 screenshots in a row that get rejected by the masses for being too obscure or challenging (and we all know that feeling :) ) then I can see why someone would just upload an easy screenshot to get it through, its comforting in a way.
I would say nice try, but probably best stop it before it turns into a flame fest :) and ultimately we need to let the democracy decide which shots go through. This is the new system we must all adapt to, better or worse. :)
EDIT TO ADD: Should also add that If I have just gone through 20 screens and not known one of them, its kind of nice to come across one which in your definition is easy and boring That extra point lifts the morale and keeps people playing :)
EDIT AGAIN : This is all my own opinion, YMMV, not intentionally trying to act like a self-righteous pompous git :)
http://whatthemovie.com/shot/21668 I dont believe everyone can see that there is an elephant (I couldnt) and then it was a big spoiler for me solving it.
Thanks them00ch, for the very thoughtful response. I think I will delete, but I might leave them up for a day first.
I don't mind if the shots are easy, I just think people could upload shots that are easy *and* interesting. I know it's frustrating not having shots make it to FF (i've only uploaded a few, and they haven't gotten there), but you can still take screenshots that will be popular, but not just headshots of actors.
Also, is there anyway to put something about how a shot should be interesting on the upload rules page? This is from the FAQ in the forum, where few people now see it:
> Your shot is not intersting. 1. Try to search the whole movie for the real best snapshot. 2. Shots, which display the main characters of a movie are often rejected, because you can easily look for their names on IMDB, and simply enter every movie. 3. Don't post shots, with people waving guns in front of the camera. We already have plenty of those.
I think these are all good rules, and the examples (which I couldn't easily copy-paste here) are excellent guidelines. Of course, these rules explained why a screenshot might not have been accepted in WTM_Beta, which is now moot, but I think it would be nice to ask uploaders to make their shots interesting.
I'm sure you picked up the subtext in my post that I do agree with you ;) but I think there are probably better ways of educating people - incorporating into the general FAQ as you suggested is an excellent idea.
Remember though, that these easy shots may intially attract people to the game/site, and more members = more donations = more money to naut/tliff = a better site for everyone :) If every shot were as obvious as the examples listed above, then yes I think it would need some drastic action, because it just wouldnt be that fun for anyone, but at present the vast majority of people do go out of their way to get interesting and challenging stills. The *occasional* easy one is a nice change of pace, as long as it does stay occasional :)
Plus as I said above I personally like the occasional easy point pickup because Im not great at this game hehe ;)
EDIT: perhaps we should open this up as a seperate thread as we are kind of de-railing the "strange tags" thread here :)
I deleted it, but then i agreed with forerunner and had to put id back (excuses to the one who posted the tag). the tag probably helps, but the text is in the still.